admin
The maintenance team for the apartment initially hesitated to contact an electrician.
B
Bet anything if your friend calls the fire department to get the fire marshal or the state’s electrical/building inspector it’ll be fixed by the end of the next day. The landlord will be pissed about it though, so make sure your friend keeps their ass covered in the future to avoid retaliation.
C
Thanks for the insight.
[
> state’s electrical/building inspector states don’t have inspectors. that stuff is done on a county or city level. and there is a very good chance they don’t do anything at all. it looks like a breaker failed to trip. you’d call the insurance company and they would handle it. although if that’s all the damage, it wouldn’t meet your deductible so you’d just call an electrician and have them handle it if you can’t do it yourself.
E
If this is a recurring issue as OP stated its something other than just a breaker fault, even the most half assed local inspector better shut this shit down.
[
you have waaaaaay too much confidence in inspectors. they are not required to have a lot of experience where I am (and in most places). I have seen things pass inspection that should not have and I have seen AHJs make up codes and requirements.
E
I work for a utility, I’ve had more than my fair share of shitty inspectors. However, once the words “fire” or “blown up” are introduced, complacency should leave the building.
[
when I worked in residential code enforcement, our only real tools were to fail the inspection or to put in a stop work order, but they didn’t like us doing stop work orders because they want things brought into compliance, and a stop work order is the opposite of that. we had some trouble with some landlords literally just stopping work and then the residents complained to city council and the landlord said ‘the city told us to stop work!’ and then the head of codes enforcement got dragged through the mud in the papers. dude had to explain that a stop work order is really a ‘stop *all other work and fix this one issue* order’ but by that point the damage was done and so word came down we weren’t to do that anymore
D
My city has some of the toughest inspectors in the country. They would all shut it down. Depends on where you live
T
Our last inspector used to be an industrial sparky. He knew NEC. That was about it. I had to show him the vents were full of water at rough. He didn’t know to check. He asked my tile setter what Red Guard was at drywall. He’d never seen it before. SMH.
T
In Washington State we have state electrical inspectors through Labor and Industries.
T
Some states have inspectors. Some states are city and county. Some states the larger localities have inspectors and the places with few people only have state electric and plumbing inspectors.
S
just call the fire department
R
and the mortician
S
the nice thing about the fire department is that they will be there in ten minutes, the owner will be there in another ten, and the electrician will be there by the end of the hour, or the landlord will pay for hotels until it’s fixed well. one nice thing
T
The fire department would likely pull the meter off, requiring an electrical inspection. The not nice part is, you won’t have power for 2-3 days while the electricians come and replace this service panel, and then the inspector comes and approves the work before the power company reinstalls the meter. That it is 34° C now, might make it uncomfortable.
S
> The not nice part is, you won’t have power for 2-3 days it’s several thousand dollars a day per tenant if the power’s out for code violations. they will pay for the overnight electrician
B
It’s the inspection that’s the pita in that case, unless your city/townships really on top of it with getting them out there. In mine they’re out there quick to get something shut down, less so for the follow-up.
T
I believe a building on fire gets a lot hotter than 34°.
T
I just mean after they cut off the electrical, and you now have to sit in no AC apartment until they get the power back on.
S
rental apartments cant be occupied if there is no power for a sustained period of time. (they arent considered habitable) most jurisdictions its anything over 24 hrs. the only exemptions are for a state of emergency. the landlords insurance would need to provide accommodations.
A
> the landlords insurance would need to provide accommodations. Which is the issue. You think a landlord who does *this* is going to play along well with accommodations? They’ll drag their feet, and maybe a court would rule in your favor, but you know how much time and effort that is to be made whole? And that’s even assuming it’s *possible* to be made whole. There’s so much fuckery that the courts wouldn’t care about. What if you have pets, which are unwelcome at most hotels? What if you have non-portable pets that *can’t* be taken with you? What if the hotel you’re told to use isn’t on a bus line, so you can’t get to work while you’re staying there? What if you bring bed bugs home? What if you don’t have the money to pay out of pocket right now, making reimbursement after the fact a moot point? Forcing a full building reinspection is the last-ditch nuclear move, only to be used when all other options have been exhausted. Even if none of those concerns apply to you, you’re not the only person living in that building, and what gives you the right to impose those things upon others unless there’s truly no other choice?
S
this is why taxes and regulation are good. and only suckers vote for people who cut them.
T
You’re not wrong, the thing we’ve seen are residents in some locations don’t want to be out of their apartment for too long, afraid looters will come in and steal their stuff. Most places though have individual meters, and as long as their electrical service isn’t off, they can stay once the inspector approves the CO. Had a fire in Richton Park, 96 unit Senior High-rise which was totally evacuated. Most residents were finding family to stay with, but the county was telling them you must provide rooms for all people, regardless. Once they saw the cost for 80+ hotel rooms, and transportation to them, they got the inspector out at 6am to get all but 3 units approved for occupancy.
P
If it takes you more than 8 hours to do a panel, you’re incredibly slow.
J
And let me introduce a house from pre 1920. Just incase you don’t know; there’s not room, nothings square and it’s been subdivided into 9 apartments.
P
I work with tons of electricians. A panel change should not take more than a day dude.
X
On a normal residential building, probably not. An apartment complex (or building) is different. They’re usually sloppily done, haphazardly wired (thanks scummy landlords!), and management puts everything off until they absolutely have to do it.
D
This is literally a 16 space sub panel, maybe 150 amps. Change out on this is maybe a couple hours. Trouble shooting the cause beyond just a bad breaker/faulty bus bar could take longer, but this is like a half day to a days job, nothing more. Dude might not be an electrician, but I am and he’s right.
U
my old house was built in 1890 somthing, and the wiring was added in and upgraded by amateurs over the century . we called in an electrician to fix something and the man spent 10 minutes just staring at the wiring in the breaker box and swearing before starting
A
You work with them, but you plainly are not one. Sit down.
P
Considering I’m around service techs all the time, I learn quite a lot. 😂 they’d tell you the same thing, shouldn’t take more than a day. If it does, you don’t need to be doing it.
T
My first assumption is the maintenance guy isn’t a licensed electrician, so the time is more about getting the licensed electrician there. Then getting the service panel and parts needed, then getting the inspector out to approve, then getting the power company there to set the meter. Wouldn’t even be surprised they would have to replace the meter base for new code of disconnect type?
S
> My first assumption is the maintenance guy isn’t a licensed electrician you seem to be under the misimpression that the fire department will allow anyone other than a licensed electrician to fix this > Then getting the service panel and parts needed it’s a lot cheaper to go to the store and buy the parts (they have these at home depot) than to pay a multiple thousand dollar a day fine the purpose of the fines is to prevent this kind of fucking around
T
Electricians don’t buy from Home Depot. They buy from electrical supply companies, at least the ones I work with, but that doesn’t really matter, as these electrical suppliers will have emergency services so the electrician calls the emergency number and gets someone to fill the request – Home Depot doesn’t do that. For a regular customer, yes Home Depot may be cheaper, but for the electrical contractor, there is a wholesale price. Interestingly, if you get on the Electrical subreddit, there are long discussions about how the big box store quality of electrical parts is lower than the supplier quality.
F
>how the big box store quality of electrical parts is lower than the supplier quality. 100% true. Also, plumbing supplies. Hold a copper fitting from big box next to one from plumbing supply and you can easily see the difference in thickness.
O
Platt sells the same breakers as Home Depot, just at wholesale pricing.
D
I have never seen or heard of the fire department asking for trade credentials on a jobsite. I suppose it could happen I guess but it would be exceedingly rare.
T
They don’t. They would just disconnect the service to ensure the building is safe, at least from electrical fires. The checking of work and credentials is done by the electrical inspector. My weird experience was one apartment, a branch fell on the service line to the building, pulling the weatherhead off the building so it was laying on the ground. The fire department, not realizing the issue, pulled the meter out of the base to cut off the electricity. The mistake was, there was still power at the meter base, so now they left exposed power lugs in the base accessible on the ground. We contacted the power company, and they cut the power to the service line, but it took about 3 hours. It only took about 2 hours to remount the weatherhead and get everything ready, but then we had to wait for the electrical inspector to certify the work, and again for the power company to reconnect and install the meter base. Honestly felt like if the FD had left it alone, could have just reattached the weatherhead, and power would have been back on in about 2 hours.
T
I don’t understand your point? First, the maintenance guy who probably worked on it first, probably isn’t a licensed electrician. Regardless the fire department won’t care who does the work, but they would pull the meter base. Their part is done, period. The issue then is about how it gets fixed, but the work would need to be inspected by the electrical inspector, which likely means the electrician needs to be licensed.
S
> Regardless the fire department won’t care who does the work This is incorrect.
T
Let me respond to you from my position. I was a Firefighter/Paramedic, so yes, I know what the Fire Department does when it arrives on a scene where the electrical service may be compromised, with the FD erroring on the side of caution. Which is to turn off the power to the house, usually by taking off the meterhead – BTW, newer houses have a disconnection function in the meter base by building code. Now the point is, as a FF, we have made sure there is no chance of electrical in this structure. We turn the meter over to the utility company. The FD job is done. Period, end of responsibility. Now, what has to happen before that meter can be reinstalled, is the structure has to be inspected by the building inspectors. Electrical, structural, plumbing if need. If electrical work is needed, this work needs to be completed and inspected, and the electrical inspector will certify it and allow the utility to reconnect the meter. The FD department has nothing to do with the inspection or checking who does the work for it to be certified. Now, as FF, and working what we called 72’s, we’d be scheduled for 24 hours, 48 hours off. During those 2 days off, I worked as an electrician for one of the local electrical contractors. I was working with one before I became I FF, and it was a nice way to supplement my income. I did the work from both positions, and I know for certain as a FF we didn’t approve or certify the reconnection of service. That was the building inspection departments role. If you know some difference, please explain?
S
You see a lot of firemen standing around supervising tradesmen making sure they do their work up to code and are licensed?!
N
If the panel is like that, imagine what the rest of the wiring is like.
K
If it were a fresh panel, I’d totally agree. But for a gut and replace with unknown wiring? Could be 8 hours, could be a week of running brand new wire. You just don’t know.
A
That seems preferrable to the entire building burning to the ground because of an electrical fire…..
T
The ‘pay for hotels’ bit was funny, though
W
Not the electrician. The power company will pull the feed.
G
And then get bullied and evicted by the landlorf for causing him shit for things he didn’t want to spend money on. Unless you’re not forced to live there for reasons, I’d move out anyway.
S
if a landlord bullies you for forced maintenance, you eventually end up taking enormous amounts of their money, and potentially the property itself
M
And what do while it winds through court??
GIPHY App Key not set. Please check settings